 Jesus drank grape-juice? |
servantsteve 
Disjasked Lerna
Registration Date: 07-02-2002
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It's been very popular to try to caste Jesus in our image. The popular paintings of Jesus looking like a hippy with long slightly waivy dirty brown hair and a beard and a European look is based in the art of the middle ages, not on any insight into what Jesus truly looked like.
Similarly, the idea that Jesus was a consumer of grape juice and a teetotaler is casting him the image of some protestant groups today. As pointed out earlier, the Scriptures don't bear that image out.
Paul told Timothy to drink a little wine with his water for the sake of his stomache. I've heard backpedaling on that on in the past. My doctor told me to never take another alcoholic beverage because I'm a hepatitis survivor.
The strongest argument against drinking centers around preserving the weaker brother. I hate being pressured into having a drink with a friend and I know recovering alcoholics with a similar problem. I have not succombed to this pressure because I value my life and I remember what the doctor said only too clearly. It's harder for a recovering alcoholic to refute, "one little drink won't hurt you- it can't even make you drunk." It may more loving to leave the alcohol out of the conversation.
Those of you who have the liberty to drink I urge to be sensitive to the needs of your brothers and sisters in the faith.
Those of us who do not drink I would also urge to be sensitive to the word of God and not try to create extra laws that the Bible does not support. If we could be saved by following laws, there would be no need for a savior.
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07-22-2002 14:31 |
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Author of the Post
A Hot Wolly
Registration Date: 03-14-2002
Posts: 499
Location: If you want to follow in someone's footsteps, first you need to learn where they've walked.
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Good points, I just have bad memories of Christian friends telling me that I couldn't hang out with certain people because they drank. And after living in Europe twice, wine with dinner is as normal to me as butter on bread.
My friends all can't believe that when I go out I have a "two drink limit" and I usually only have one drink, if that. But I like my scotch on the rocks on a Friday night when I go country line dancing. It's part of my weekly ritual. I've just seen too many people get all gung ho about decisions that they've made or they've allowed a religious group to make for them and then using God and Jesus to back their decision. It's like friends of mine who are vegitarians and are out to save all the animals and make me stop eating meat. Not gonna happen.
But I have several friends who are friends of Bill W. and I'm very sensitive to their struggle. I'm not one to tell anyone they must drink, should drink, etc. I think it's a personal choice and as long as your behavoir is not harming yourself (constant drunkeness) or others (fights, reckless driving, etc.) it's all okay. I don't see it as an issue to quote Scriptures on as to whether it is okay or not okay.
Just my 2 cents.
-- TAotP
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07-22-2002 15:31 |
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Dr Rich
Ubique Epoque
Registration Date: 03-15-2002
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Location: Hoverkrafti im është plot me ngjala.
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I likes me a Vodka Tonic, and beer is nice as well 
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07-22-2002 19:46 |
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Author of the Post
A Hot Wolly
Registration Date: 03-14-2002
Posts: 499
Location: If you want to follow in someone's footsteps, first you need to learn where they've walked.
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| quote: |
Originally posted by Dr Rich
I likes me a Vodka Tonic, and beer is nice as well
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I can't stand tonic. Nor am I a big beer fan (only on hot days when I'm in the mood.) I'm more a wine and whiskey kind of guy (but not mixed together.)
As for Vodka, there are some good ones out there. The first time I lived in Barcelona I lived next door some Estonias who brought a bottle of Vodka from their country. That was some STRONG stuff. I have some funny pictures from that evening! 
-- TAotP
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07-23-2002 08:40 |
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Woggy
Platyhelminth
Registration Date: 03-13-2002
Posts: 6,079
Location: "Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." ~~ Albert Einstein
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| Getting back to this again............. |
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Originally posted by Author of the Post
But I have several friends who are friends of Bill W. and I'm very sensitive to their struggle. I'm not one to tell anyone they must drink, should drink, etc. I think it's a personal choice and as long as your behavoir is not harming yourself (constant drunkeness) or others (fights, reckless driving, etc.) it's all okay. I don't see it as an issue to quote Scriptures on as to whether it is okay or not okay.
Just my 2 cents.
-- TAotP
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Hi TatoPop:
The more I read you, the more I like you. You just THINK and SAY things that are so sensible. Thanks........
Anywhooooo, I, too, have some dear acquaintances in my circle who are devotees of Bill W. And here's what one of them tells me, frequently (this one being my husband's Father, my dear FIL, my good friend.........) He knows he cannot drink. He knows that others can. He never, ever tells them they shouldn't. He also knows his son should STOP, but doesn't know how to help him in that area (doesn't want to alienate him, so tries not to say too much.) I hang out with my FIL's friends from AA. They all say the same thing..............some can, some can't, some shouldn't. We're all different in this regard - but I'll bet that any long-time AA member will tell you the same thing. They are not bothered by other's drinking.
As for those who oppose drinking, in any way, shape or form? I try to not even go into the discussion - why make a fuss? But if someone WANTS to argue the point with me - I'll do the debate thing.
If I'm gonna have al-kee-hol, I like a nice cold beer the best. Or a rum'n'coke. And I've overdone it too many times in my life to enjoy that anymore..............just a quiet little glow is fine
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1 John 2:6
Whoever claims to live in him must walk as Jesus did.
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07-31-2002 15:47 |
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Author of the Post
A Hot Wolly
Registration Date: 03-14-2002
Posts: 499
Location: If you want to follow in someone's footsteps, first you need to learn where they've walked.
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| quote: |
Originally posted by Woggy
Hi TatoPop:
The more I read you, the more I like you. You just THINK and SAY things that are so sensible. Thanks........
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Thanks ChickyWoggy! I'm not quite sure I like this TatoPop. Does that have any meaning? Did you see my thread dedicated all to you?
-- aotp
(and yes, I can post a lot of stupid dribble, but you sit me down to dinner or coffee and most people see that there's a lot of depth to my soul. I try to capture it my writing, not an easy task to do. How can you really translate raw emotions into words?)
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07-31-2002 15:56 |
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Dr Rich
Ubique Epoque
Registration Date: 03-15-2002
Posts: 9,986
Location: Hoverkrafti im është plot me ngjala.
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I am getting hammerd tonight!
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07-31-2002 17:28 |
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Woggy
Platyhelminth
Registration Date: 03-13-2002
Posts: 6,079
Location: "Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." ~~ Albert Einstein
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| Oh, it\'s just the way I look at things....... |
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| quote: |
Originally posted by Author of the Post
| quote: |
Originally posted by Woggy
Hi TatoPop:
The more I read you, the more I like you. You just THINK and SAY things that are so sensible. Thanks........
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Thanks ChickyWoggy! I'm not quite sure I like this TatoPop. Does that have any meaning? Did you see my thread dedicated all to you?
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You see, when I look at the acronymn for your name
- aotp
I see "tatopop"
Don't ask me why. I think it's kinda cute. But if you don't like it, I won't call you that...........
And yes, I saw that most awesome thread. I shall have to visit it, I think, right now.
__________________
1 John 2:6
Whoever claims to live in him must walk as Jesus did.
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08-01-2002 15:52 |
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Author of the Post
A Hot Wolly
Registration Date: 03-14-2002
Posts: 499
Location: If you want to follow in someone's footsteps, first you need to learn where they've walked.
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| quote: |
Originally posted by Woggy
You see, when I look at the acronymn for your name
- aotp
I see "tatopop"
Don't ask me why. I think it's kinda cute. But if you don't like it, I won't call you that...........
And yes, I saw that most awesome thread. I shall have to visit it, I think, right now.
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Tatopop makes me think of "Antropop" which was the name of an album by the Spanish Pop group "OBK."
-- aotp
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08-02-2002 12:59 |
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Lost Canine
Disjasked Lerna
Registration Date: 03-13-2002
Posts: 4,011
Location: On a rock in the ocean...literally
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| quote: |
Originally posted by Author of the Post
| quote: |
Originally posted by Woggy
You see, when I look at the acronymn for your name
- aotp
I see "tatopop"
Don't ask me why. I think it's kinda cute. But if you don't like it, I won't call you that...........
And yes, I saw that most awesome thread. I shall have to visit it, I think, right now.
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Tatopop makes me think of "Antropop" which was the name of an album by the Spanish Pop group "OBK."
-- aotp
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I always think of tafkap (Prince). Don't know why, just always comes to my mind. And I like Prince's music, so there, I admitted it.
LK-9
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08-02-2002 16:40 |
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Dr Rich
Ubique Epoque
Registration Date: 03-15-2002
Posts: 9,986
Location: Hoverkrafti im është plot me ngjala.
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| quote: |
Originally posted by BigDork
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Originally posted by Dr Rich
I am getting hammerd tonight!
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sledge or ball peen?
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ball peen!
I'm a wimp 
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08-03-2002 12:44 |
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Lost Canine
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Doc, you jump around like a madman.
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08-03-2002 12:48 |
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dorfsmith
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Registration Date: 03-24-2002
Posts: 28,142
Location: Everybody needs a persicom
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Last year I had about 10 shots of Black Velvet. Very bad experience. Now I stick to Vodka, beer, Mikes, or wine.
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08-03-2002 19:56 |
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Lost Canine
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| quote: |
Originally posted by dorfsmith
Last year I had about 10 shots of Black Velvet. Very bad experience. Now I stick to Vodka, beer, Mikes, or wine.
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Are you really George Thoroughgood?
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08-03-2002 21:41 |
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Mark
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Registration Date: 03-18-2002
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Location: Grand Encephalon - Words have their place but live what you say God can have His way when you hit them with Love
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Bad to the bone
One bourbon, one scotch, one beer
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But never, never pin your whole faith on any human being: not if he is the best and wisest in the whole world. - C.S. Lewis
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08-03-2002 21:42 |
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Lost Canine
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Location: On a rock in the ocean...literally
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| quote: |
Originally posted by Mark
Bad to the bone
One bourbon, one scotch, one beer
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Sing it in your best "George" voice, Mark!
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08-03-2002 21:43 |
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Mark
Moderator
Registration Date: 03-18-2002
Posts: 9,525
Location: Grand Encephalon - Words have their place but live what you say God can have His way when you hit them with Love
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I'll try
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But never, never pin your whole faith on any human being: not if he is the best and wisest in the whole world. - C.S. Lewis
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08-03-2002 21:46 |
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Lost Canine
Disjasked Lerna
Registration Date: 03-13-2002
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Uh, let's keep this on topic! Hide the beer, the pastor's here!
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08-03-2002 21:47 |
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