audiori 
Administrator
Registration Date: 03-12-2002
Posts: 11,145
Location: Missouri
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Everybody in the band appreciated Leo...
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"Blessed is he who expecteth nothing, for he shall enjoy everything" -St. Francis of Assisi
"A strange fanaticism fills our time: the fanatical hatred of morality, especially of Christian morality." - GK Chesterton
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06-01-2012 13:41 |
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Audiori J
Administrator
Registration Date: 11-27-2004
Posts: 7,728
Location: "Clowns to the left of me! Jokers to the right! Here I AM stuck in the middle with you." - Stealers Wheel
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Aye Agnus, 'twas the year.
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"Education is the ability to listen to almost anything without losing your temper or your self-confidence." ~ Robert Frost
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06-01-2012 16:05 |
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audiori
Administrator
Registration Date: 03-12-2002
Posts: 11,145
Location: Missouri
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Its all opinion. One does not outweigh the other. You liking a bunch of bands from the fest doesn't mean that other people have "tunnel vision" or that their view doesn't "hold water." I'm sure Jason can also name a bunch of other (non-DA) bands that he's liked at Cstone over the years. He'd probably name Fleming and John and a number of others. That doesn't change anything.
The fact is a lot of people... not just DA fans... believe that Cornerstone started turning away from its original vision. This is something that I have heard from people chatting around the merch tent.. or at the main stage in between shows. Its enough people that it can't just be "Tunnel vision" or imagined. No one is suggesting that the Powers-that-be at Cornerstone had some kind of ill-intent or were trying to destroy the festival or anything silly like that. Its just that there was a feeling amongst a lot of people that things were moving away from what made the Festival great. On the other side of the token, I'm sure there are people that felt like it was getting better every year. Everyone is entitled to their own perspective and opinion and none of them can be "proven."
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"Blessed is he who expecteth nothing, for he shall enjoy everything" -St. Francis of Assisi
"A strange fanaticism fills our time: the fanatical hatred of morality, especially of Christian morality." - GK Chesterton
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06-06-2012 21:18 |
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vapspwi
Dark Steamy Cabbage
Registration Date: 02-21-2007
Posts: 21
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| quote: |
Originally posted by dennis
Agreed, it seems Vespacow has an axe to grind.
Add some screaming and chainsaws and there's another crappy band to fill up a slot at cornerstone.
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The only axe I have to grind is the truth, and to assert that Cornerstone has been blowing all their money on big bands and not booking any quality smaller bands simply isn't true. I posted that list of almost 40 quality bands across a lot of styles to illustrate that the fest isn't "tobyMac and 100 bands that they could book for $20 each with the money they had left."
If you're looking for somebody with an axe to grind, then let's be honest - you need to be looking at the guy who's complaining that the fest hasn't booked a group of bands that barely exist anymore (DA, 77s, etc.) enough over the last decade or so, and is using demonstrably false assertions ("the fest elected for quantity and not quality") to try to back up that claim. I'd be shocked to hear about an instance where DA wanted to play the fest and Cornerstone said "no thanks" - they put them on Main Stage last year, for crying out loud.
I'm not saying there's not a lot of crap bands at Cornerstone. I've got no interest in hardcore and death metal and that sort of stuff, and I've gone to great lengths to avoid that stuff in recent years (my friends and I listen to every band on the schedule to figure out what they sound like, and make a custom schedule booklet with a description of every band at the fest, including generator stages, prioritized according to our general tastes). I am saying that there's still more good music there than you could listen to in a week. I used my personal tastes, which are fairly broad, as an example, and didn't really even get into all the other stuff that was there in 2007 that I recognize as quality but don't find to my tastes, stuff ranging from Glenn Kaiser to the Myriad to Pigeon John to the Crossing.
JRjr
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06-07-2012 07:16 |
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Audiori J
Administrator
Registration Date: 11-27-2004
Posts: 7,728
Location: "Clowns to the left of me! Jokers to the right! Here I AM stuck in the middle with you." - Stealers Wheel
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| quote: |
Originally posted by vapspwi
I'd be shocked to hear about an instance where DA wanted to play the fest and Cornerstone said "no thanks" - they put them on Main Stage last year, for crying out loud.
JRjr |
It has happened. There have been years where DA wanted to play, but were told that the fest was going in a different direction. There were years where DA was told that the fest only wanted to book certain types of bands every few years.
| quote: |
Originally posted by vapspwi
....the fest hasn't booked a group of bands that barely exist anymore (DA, 77s, etc.) enough over the last decade or so...
JRjr |
I would argue that bands such as these exist in a far greater state than many of the 'here today gone tomorrow' bands that play the fest. If anyone barely exists, it would be those bands who just started but probably won't be around next week.
There are reasons why bands like the 77s, DA, etc have lasted 20, 30 or 40 years. There is a certain 'quality' that just isn't present with the bands that come and go in a flash. That quality generates a loyal following that allows the band to continue inspite of the general market and other factors. These bands understand their loyal fans and there is a mutually benificial relationship that endures.
Cornerstone either didn't understand this dynamic or they understood it and ignored it to a large degree. And I am saying that might be why Cornerstone is ending but these bands are not. They originally tapped into that dynamic, but over the course of the last decade they have turned their back on it to varying degrees.
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"Education is the ability to listen to almost anything without losing your temper or your self-confidence." ~ Robert Frost
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06-07-2012 07:44 |
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John Foxe
Woolly Eggwhisk
Registration Date: 03-12-2002
Posts: 654
Location: Elkhart, Indiana
Thread Starter 
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vapspwi, let me tell you as graciously as I can, from someone who started and has quietly followed this thread, that your choice of words is needlessly provocative ("demonstratively false assertions", "barely exist anymore", etc.). Please be considerate - tone it down and try not to flame, it is not helpful.
I will stand by my perspective as I started this thread, and it has been confirmed by others who know much more from the inside. If the Townsends are speculating on certain things, doesn't it follow that we speculate to a much greater degree? Give them some grace and benefit of the doubt... they are invested in the fest to a much greater degree than either of us, know the bands far better than we do, and are privy to details that we will never know.
We are on the same side, hopefully - we all want the best for the bands we love, and we are sincerely mourning the pending death of a beloved outlet for some great Christian music and camaraderie.
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I'm a middle-aged hitchhiker...
LetsSpin@comcast.net
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06-07-2012 07:52 |
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Ron E
Platyhelminth
Registration Date: 03-12-2002
Posts: 5,610
Location: Central Ontario Canada
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I'm with you fellers.
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The opinion expressed is that of the participant and does not necessarily reflect that of Mr Dan Amos. But if it doesn't, he would be wrong.
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06-07-2012 08:21 |
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dennis
Ubique Epoque
Registration Date: 09-19-2002
Posts: 13,303
Location: In not-quite earth, in not-quite heaven.
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| quote: |
Originally posted by John Foxe
vapspwi, let me tell you as graciously as I can, from someone who started and has quietly followed this thread, that your choice of words is needlessly provocative ("demonstratively false assertions", "barely exist anymore", etc.). Please be considerate - tone it down and try not to flame, it is not helpful.
I will stand by my perspective as I started this thread, and it has been confirmed by others who know much more from the inside. If the Townsends are speculating on certain things, doesn't it follow that we speculate to a much greater degree? Give them some grace and benefit of the doubt... they are invested in the fest to a much greater degree than either of us, know the bands far better than we do, and are privy to details that we will never know.
We are on the same side, hopefully - we all want the best for the bands we love, and we are sincerely mourning the pending death of a beloved outlet for some great Christian music and camaraderie. |
Very well put good sir.
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I'm talkin' bout the Vinyl , the Holy Vinyl.
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06-07-2012 15:55 |
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John Foxe
Woolly Eggwhisk
Registration Date: 03-12-2002
Posts: 654
Location: Elkhart, Indiana
Thread Starter
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Dennis, I don't know if you remember me, but I met you in 2002 at LifeFest, at the SwEds concert. That year was fun but weird - remember how crazy they were about time frames, holding those signs up? That was also the last time I saw Rick Altizer - he's a cool guy and a great musician.
Anyway, this c-stone will probably be the last time a lot of us will be in one spot, so if I make it there I will be saying hello (and goodbye) to everyone with a DA, SE, LD, TST, 77s, or related shirt on.
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I'm a middle-aged hitchhiker...
LetsSpin@comcast.net
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06-07-2012 16:18 |
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dennis
Ubique Epoque
Registration Date: 09-19-2002
Posts: 13,303
Location: In not-quite earth, in not-quite heaven.
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| quote: |
Originally posted by John Foxe
Dennis, I don't know if you remember me, but I met you in 2002 at LifeFest, at the SwEds concert. That year was fun but weird - remember how crazy they were about time frames, holding those signs up? That was also the last time I saw Rick Altizer - he's a cool guy and a great musician.
Anyway, this c-stone will probably be the last time a lot of us will be in one spot, so if I make it there I will be saying hello (and goodbye) to everyone with a DA, SE, LD, TST, 77s, or related shirt on. |
Yes I remember you, Lifest certainly was interesting, it was cool but it seemed to be very weird in many ways too.
I enjoyed meeting you, we had a very enjoyable visit, I thought.
The Swirling Eddies jam band was so much fun as was Mike and the Trophy wives.
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I'm talkin' bout the Vinyl , the Holy Vinyl.
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06-07-2012 17:17 |
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Audiori J
Administrator
Registration Date: 11-27-2004
Posts: 7,728
Location: "Clowns to the left of me! Jokers to the right! Here I AM stuck in the middle with you." - Stealers Wheel
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LifeFest was interesting. I met Dennis there as well.
They stuck the Eddies in some sort of fenced in dirt pit. The Eddies were kind of booked for that fest without Terry realizing they were going to do that.. so they had basically no chance to rehearse at all. Which made it interesting.. it ended up being a weird, weird jam group. Mike Roe also performed with the Trophy Wives as backup. Rick Altizer performed "I Love You #19" at his set, which was pretty cool to hear live.
They also made us shut down the merch booth every time a speaker spoke somewhere in the fest, which rendered the merch booth pretty much moot. At one point I thought I would use one of the frequent 'shut downs' to go get a drink, but they wouldn't even sell me a water while someone was speaking so I shrivelled up and blew away.
There was also some weirdness at the time because M8 had a booth there after all the bands had broken ties with them. They had been turned in by a few artists for bootlegging them, and they acted kinda shifty and weird towards us. Everyone had to kind of keep an eye out for them and what they were up to.
I was told at the time, by someone who had worked for the bands whose words were not always trustworthy, that the check Lifefest sent to pay the Eddies had bounced. Like I said, not exactly sure if that was true. But at the time it seemed like there was always some weird shenanigans going on, which was frustrating then and hard to decipher now.
I did really enjoy a nice pizza back at the hotel after the show though.. wish I could remember what it was called. Steve Hindalong talked my ears off, which seemed to amuse Tim Chandler for some reason.
....And yeah, I won't be at this Cornerstone, don't see much point in it really. As I said elsewhere I will miss sharing those long dusty hot hours in that tent joking back and forth with Dan and Lisa Michaels. But I have long since mourned the fest itself.
But the topper was Onefest in Memphis for the Legends Tour, one of the fest guys drove us and our merch down to the stage where DA and the other bands were booked. On the way down he asked us "Why are you here since nobody wants you here?" The logic is a little odd since they booked the bands, but more importantly it was quite a warm greeting.
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"Education is the ability to listen to almost anything without losing your temper or your self-confidence." ~ Robert Frost
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06-07-2012 16:33 |
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audiori
Administrator
Registration Date: 03-12-2002
Posts: 11,145
Location: Missouri
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| quote: |
Originally posted by Audiori J
I did really enjoy a nice pizza back at the hotel after the show though.. wish I could remember what it was called. Steve Hindalong talked my ears off, which seemed to amuse Tim Chandler for some reason.
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It was something like the Pizza Pit or Pizza Hole... it didn't sound very appetizing, but it actually was pretty good.
Bill Mallonee was there also.. Mike, Derri and Terry.. maybe Mike Stand? That was all in the hotel bar after the pizza though.
I also always liked Aurelio's Pizza in Macomb. Always made sure to get one of those on every Cstone trip. It as one of the few pizzas that seem to still be cooking while it was sitting on your table.
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"Blessed is he who expecteth nothing, for he shall enjoy everything" -St. Francis of Assisi
"A strange fanaticism fills our time: the fanatical hatred of morality, especially of Christian morality." - GK Chesterton
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06-07-2012 17:56 |
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Ritchie_az
Ceremonial Kernel
Registration Date: 07-02-2008
Posts: 2,139
Location: Arizona
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And that's why we need a Lost Dog's fest or annual big concert thingy....
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My Photography Blog
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06-07-2012 18:34 |
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dennis
Ubique Epoque
Registration Date: 09-19-2002
Posts: 13,303
Location: In not-quite earth, in not-quite heaven.
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Steve Hindalong was pretty chatty with me too. Great guy, very open and friendly. He gave me his setlists with his notes. My friend Jon ( Lucy) and I shared them.
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I'm talkin' bout the Vinyl , the Holy Vinyl.
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06-07-2012 19:07 |
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sondance
Ceremonial Kernel
Registration Date: 05-04-2006
Posts: 1,815
Location: sittin' on the dock of the bay
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you guys are making me jealous... still "why are you here since nobody wants you here" seems to be a rather fundamental existential question doesn't it?
a kind of milestone in life: here is a time when I was there and nobody wanted me there. i think parents, teachers and cops can relate, along with the homeless and many Presidents
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Though I have become like a wineskin in the smoke,
I do not forget your statutes.
Psalm 119:83
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06-07-2012 21:57 |
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audiori
Administrator
Registration Date: 03-12-2002
Posts: 11,145
Location: Missouri
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| quote: |
Originally posted by sondance
you guys are making me jealous... still "why are you here since nobody wants you here" seems to be a rather fundamental existential question doesn't it?
a kind of milestone in life: here is a time when I was there and nobody wanted me there. i think parents, teachers and cops can relate, along with the homeless and many Presidents |
While we're on the subject..
Does the Solipsist exist if his own mind doesn't want him here?
__________________
"Blessed is he who expecteth nothing, for he shall enjoy everything" -St. Francis of Assisi
"A strange fanaticism fills our time: the fanatical hatred of morality, especially of Christian morality." - GK Chesterton
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06-08-2012 00:09 |
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wakachiwaka
Ceremonial Kernel
Registration Date: 07-26-2007
Posts: 1,209
Location: Glendale, CA
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| quote: |
Originally posted by dennis
Steve Hindalong was pretty chatty with me too. Great guy, very open and friendly. He gave me his setlists with his notes. My friend Jon ( Lucy) and I shared them. |
As a friend of mine once remarked to me re. her first encounter with Indy Hindy: "God help the man if he ever drinks a Coke!"
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06-07-2012 23:34 |
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dennis
Ubique Epoque
Registration Date: 09-19-2002
Posts: 13,303
Location: In not-quite earth, in not-quite heaven.
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| quote: |
Originally posted by wakachiwaka
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Originally posted by dennis
Steve Hindalong was pretty chatty with me too. Great guy, very open and friendly. He gave me his setlists with his notes. My friend Jon ( Lucy) and I shared them. |
As a friend of mine once remarked to me re. her first encounter with Indy Hindy: "God help the man if he ever drinks a Coke!"
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Too funny!!!
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I'm talkin' bout the Vinyl , the Holy Vinyl.
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06-08-2012 05:27 |
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DwDunphy
Ceremonial Kernel
Registration Date: 08-18-2003
Posts: 1,817
Location: Red Bank, New Jersey
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He must have had a major life-shift from when I saw him, much later, as part of Terry's home-concert run. Steve was much, much quieter -- not necessarily introverted but severely on-guard.
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06-08-2012 04:32 |
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