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Posted by Jevon the Tall on 07-14-2004 at20:21:

  The Minority Report

... one stuffed sock later ...

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Posted by Mountain Fan on 07-14-2004 at22:41:

 

stick a sock in it devo jevo!

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Posted by bereal on 07-15-2004 at00:00:

 

Dude, what's wrong with you? Mutt is great, IMHO! Steve's percussion adds to the CD (and to the show!) Now if I had played those percussion instruments, I would sound like a 5 year old banging away on em, but Steve has the technique down, especially playing more than one percussion instrument at a time. And to watch him is very interesting. His expressive eyes show his level of concentration.

btw, have you ever tried to play the drums???????

A few weeks ago we got together with some friends for a BBQ and jam session. Their son plays drums, but he had went to a friends house, so we took turns playing the drums. When it was my turn, I couldn't believe how hard it was to play. I can keep a beat, no problem, but to make the percussion sound good was the challenge. I don't think I quite met the challenge!

Mutt does sound a little more countrified than SR/LRRH era, but I think it's wonderful! All that comin from a country girl at heart!

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Posted by Jevon the Tall on 07-15-2004 at01:53:

 

I'm not saying Steve's he's not talented - unlike a certail carl, I have all of the Choir's albums.

What I'm saying is choice of percussion as accent - particularly some of the choices don't work well. I've played the album for a number of others who have commented on it as well.

Hey it's a good album.

I'll put a sock in it, of course if that's what you want. I'd hate to be the only one who makes any less than perfect comments about the boys.

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Posted by ProdigalDog on 07-15-2004 at06:43:

 

I have really enjoyed the new CD, MUTT. Perhaps it helped to see the Lost Dogs play live (and watch Steve do his groovy thing on precussions) before hearing the CD (but I don't think so). Also, I have never had much exposure to The Chior or 77's so many of the songs are actually new to me and I don't have any preconceived notions about those songs. I can't find any fault with the CD, really (other than it is too short -- but how many times does that have to be said?).

Someone can always find fault with something, though, and there is no way even a band as gifted as the Lost Dogs are can please everybody all the time. The problem I have always had with critics is that basically, what they are doing is stating their opinion (or bias in some cases). Take a typical movie: one critic raves about it and another thinks it stinks. Which one is right?

Anyway, as TST says: "Don't lay your hate on me bro!"

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Posted by carl on 07-15-2004 at07:30:

quote:

Originally posted by Jevon the Tall I'm not saying Steve's he's not talented - unlike a certail carl, I have all of the Choir's albums.

Hey, don't bite the hand that's still slapping you on the back....

quote:

Hey it's a good album..

Well, it's better than Real Men Cry, anyway. In the words of Randy Jackson, it's just aiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight, dawg.

quote:

I'll put a sock in it, of course if that's what you want. I'd hate to be the only one who makes any less than perfect comments about the boys.

Dude, I SO have yr back (but I suspect you've already noticed that)....

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Posted by carl on 07-15-2004 at07:38:

quote:

Originally posted by ProdigalDog Someone can always find fault with something, though, and there is no way even a band as gifted as the Lost Dogs are can please everybody all the time. The problem I have always had with critics is that basically, what they are doing is stating their opinion (or bias in some cases).

Well, YEAH. The audioris might as well shut the board down if we're gonna limit the posts here to non-opinions.

quote:

Take a typical movie: one critic raves about it and another thinks it stinks. Which one is right?

Either the one who's honest or the one who exposes his biases so nakedly that he ends up serving his enemy anyway. I've bought many a CD/movie ticket based on a negative review, because something that someone so clearly wrong could hate so much MUST, therefore, be something I'd like.

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Posted by jiminy on 07-15-2004 at08:12:

 

Jev and all-
it must be a matter of taste- because I loved all steves touches on the tunes on the very first listen. To me it sounds like an original flare for the Dogs (and one they wont repeat, Im sure some are hoping.).

So did the (not a lot) that I have let hear it. One new "convert" here at work comented on it without any prompting- "ohh, I like the chimes and all"

Is just interesting that the thing I felt was the glue sounds to you like the sandpaper.
I will concur (IMHO) that Tims excellent work is subdued, but the entire tone of the project has a subdued feel..and well, thats just me.

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Posted by Eleanor on 07-15-2004 at08:56:

 

for the record


I'm with carl and jev on this one


don't hate it, but I don't love it

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Posted by carl on 07-15-2004 at09:25:



In its defense (somewhat), the people I brought to the show loved it. I can't wait to watch their heads to explode when I turn them on to the REALLY good stuff.

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Posted by Mountain Fan on 07-15-2004 at11:44:

 

quote:

Originally posted by carl quote: Originally posted by Jevon the Tall ... [quote]Hey it's a good album.. Well, it's better than Real Men Cry, anyway. In the words of Randy Jackson, it's just aiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight, dawg. quote: I'll put a sock in it, of course if that's what you want. I'd hate to be the only one who makes any less than perfect comments about the boys. Dude, I SO have yr back (but I suspect you've already noticed that)....

It is NOT better than Real Men Cry!

Divergent opinions OK. I do in fact have a less than perfect opinion of MUTT, just not as down on it as some are.

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Posted by carl on 07-15-2004 at11:54:

 

quote:

Originally posted by Mountain Fan quote: Originally posted by carl quote: Originally posted by Jevon the Tall ... [quote]Hey it's a good album.. Well, it's better than Real Men Cry, anyway. In the words of Randy Jackson, it's just aiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight, dawg. quote: I'll put a sock in it, of course if that's what you want. I'd hate to be the only one who makes any less than perfect comments about the boys. Dude, I SO have yr back (but I suspect you've already noticed that).... It is NOT better than Real Men Cry!

Is too. At least the version they released. "Sterile" is the only word I can think of for it. Got to be a production thing, considering....

Incredibly -- especially considering my low opinion of live albums in general -- if you put together all the live takes I have of stuff from RMC you have a MUCH better album. Heck, I'd rather have "In the Distance" from the Dogs DVD as a single than all of the "official" RMC put together. What an incredible performance.

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Posted by Mountain Fan on 07-15-2004 at11:57:

 

quote:

Originally posted by carl quote: Originally posted by Mountain Fan quote: Originally posted by carl quote: Originally posted by Jevon the Tall ... [quote]Hey it's a good album.. Well, it's better than Real Men Cry, anyway. In the words of Randy Jackson, it's just aiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight, dawg. quote: I'll put a sock in it, of course if that's what you want. I'd hate to be the only one who makes any less than perfect comments about the boys. Dude, I SO have yr back (but I suspect you've already noticed that).... It is NOT better than Real Men Cry! Is too. At least the version they released. "Sterile" is the only word I can think of for it. Got to be a production thing, considering.... Incredibly -- especially considering my low opinion of live albums in general -- if you put together all the live takes I have of stuff from RMC you have a MUCH better album. Heck, I'd rather have "In the Distance" from the Dogs DVD as a single than all of the "official" RMC put together. What an incredible performance.

I would usually rather have them live, too. But even with possible production issues, RMC is superior to MUTT. The originals outweigh the old rework IMHO.

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Posted by carl on 07-15-2004 at12:01:



If all things were equal (i.e., if it could be judged purely on the songs), I'd probably agree.

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Posted by Jevon the Tall on 07-15-2004 at12:39:

 

carl, you rock.

... and to all, let me clarify - this is good. And it will grow on me even more with time. Like all LD albums, this is just part of the litter.

The boys live are a treat, one of the best who in my opinion deserve bigger audiences than they draw. But when you think on it, they can go almost anywhere and draw close to a hundred fan. They're not huge, but they are everywhere.

Jim, and all who really like it - good.

It was cool to read the 3am column, he visits the board once in a while, and he's pretty funny.

Back to the beach ... it's summer.

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Posted by audiori on 07-15-2004 at12:48:

 

quote:

Well, YEAH. The audioris might as well shut the board down if we're gonna limit the posts here to non-opinions.

We are not against the expression of opinion.

I guess what we deal with is what exactly is the purpose
of expressing a negative review? What is the goal?
Is it to discourage others from buying so the guys go broke
and have to retire?

Anyone ever hear the phrase; "If you can't say something nice..."

Why is it when something is released that the guys
are counting on selling to pay the bills... so they don't
go too far in debt...that people have take financial risks
to produce... that people have paid for good advertising
on... there is always a couple fans that imediately feel the
need to express to all the outlets their dissapointment
with the project? Like it's their campaign to sink the
release....

Is it to help the guys? Or is it to hurt them?

I really am trying to understand this phenomenon.
I mean if you don't like the style of an album...fine, but
whats the NEED to express that to everyone?

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Posted by Mountain Fan on 07-15-2004 at12:55:

 

quote:

Originally posted by audiori quote: Well, YEAH. The audioris might as well shut the board down if we're gonna limit the posts here to non-opinions. We are not against the expression of opinion. I guess what we deal with is what exactly is the purpose of expressing a negative review? What is the goal? Is it to discourage others from buying so the guys go broke and have to retire? Anyone ever hear the phrase; "If you can't say something nice..." Why is it when something is released that the guys are counting on selling to pay the bills... so they don't go too far in debt...that people have take financial risks to produce... that people have paid for good advertising on... there is always a couple fans that imediately feel the need to express to all the outlets their dissapointment with the project? Like it's their campaign to sink the release.... Is it to help the guys? Or is it to hurt them? I really am trying to understand this phenomenon. I mean if you don't like the style of an album...fine, but whats the NEED to express that to everyone?

I have made many good and not-so-good comments about MUTT. I would certainly respect and understand if you say no more, or move these threads to the dump.

But I hope the boys can manage to hear reality and both good and bad of what fans think. If you really think this drivel might really impact sales, then I would advising moving the threads to the dump IMHO.

And I would encourage anyone to buy MUTT, the price is worth admission by any standards.

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Posted by audiori on 07-15-2004 at13:14:

 

Well, not sure we want to do that. I am just trying to
understand the spirit behind such posts.

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Posted by DaLe on 07-15-2004 at13:41:

 

quote:

Originally posted by audiori Anyone ever hear the phrase; "If you can't say something nice..." ?

I have

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Posted by carl on 07-15-2004 at13:42:

 

quote:

Originally posted by audiori quote: Well, YEAH. The audioris might as well shut the board down if we're gonna limit the posts here to non-opinions. We are not against the expression of opinion.

(several deep breaths and edits later....)

I was sorta hoping that you'd realize that wasn't directed at you. Just making yet again the point that 98% of what goes on here is opinion, and that getting bent over it is almost always uglier than the opinion itself.

quote:

I guess what we deal with is what exactly is the purpose of expressing a negative review? What is the goal? Is it to discourage others from buying so the guys go broke and have to retire?

I think it's to expunge guilt for knowing that being honest would inevitably result in these kind of posts, in my case. And because I see this place as one where I can be honest, even if we disagree.

quote:

Anyone ever hear the phrase; "If you can't say something nice..."

I have. But it's why most churches suck. It's certainly why my current day job glows with warmth. And why we need bands like the ones we all appreciate who don't say something nice either, and boards where we can lay it out with fear of repercussion.

quote:

Why is it when something is released that the guys are counting on selling to pay the bills... so they don't go too far in debt...that people have take financial risks to produce... that people have paid for good advertising on... there is always a couple fans that imediately feel the need to express to all the outlets their dissapointment with the project? Like it's their campaign to sink the release.... Is it to help the guys? Or is it to hurt them?

It's to give an opinion, and thus help others sort out their own. See my comment from the post you quoted the above from re: negative reviews. Nobody's done a unilateral slam here. But if you like....

To anyone who reads this thread and decides not to buy Mutt strictly on the basis of it: Y'r a stone moron. Get a life.

quote:

I really am trying to understand this phenomenon. I mean if you don't like the style of an album...fine, but whats the NEED to express that to everyone?

Because we're FANS, that's why. We kvetch because we care.

carl
np: a really really bad album released 6/28 to hear my opinion of it depicted by others than myself